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cew
Sudoku Player
Registered: 07/27/09
Posts: 2

    08/17/09 at 10:15 AMReply with quote#1

I have seen several comments that empty rectangles fall into a category of difficult useless strategies.  Although only one candidate is removed, I find them an easy to spot pattern with a moderate frequency of occurrence.  I wonder if the reluctance to use them is because of a poor explanation of what to look for.  The name “empty rectangle” is confusing.  What is ‘in’ the box is important.  Candidates in one box confined to one row and one column and simple intersection strategy. Is the attached doc. a better explanation?

I wish the alternating inference network was as easy.  Seems to be a must for the very difficult puzzles. I am studying “fenyx’s” technique but not sure I can master it.    

 

 
Attached Files:
doc Brain_basher_8-15-09.doc (37.00 KB, 183 views)

tman1937
Sudoku Master
Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 200

    08/18/09 at 09:30 AMReply with quote#2

  i had to look back to see how i did aug15th and i remembered i looked at the ones an didnt ring any bells but heres how i saw it......im sure it wasnt the only way but for me it was the simplest.......ill just give u the numbers and anyone could (possibly)see it my way ....this is not to prove anything other then what a person uses with what knowledge they have........i saw the 167s    and looked up to see in line C  the 127  and the 17.....only takes a second to figure it out and it takes  u to the end.....the 6 has to go in G  or H so you can remove the only odd number in the lot....being the 2 in C2....and thats how i saw it    tman

  some are great at this and some just arnt huh    im in the dumb end but like the way im able to just simply spot em

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tman1937
Sudoku Master
Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 200

    08/18/09 at 10:10 AMReply with quote#3

 im  sry i did find that i posted this before awhile back...i recalled looking at the ones in this puzz and continued on to other things but looked again at them and i ONLY removed the SINGLE ones left over after i circled only 2 in a line in a box.....the right one has to be in the circle but dont no which one so hoping it will get you more plays(and to date it has) might even b a name for this but its very easy to do it this way .... if u think of it as a wag that would be beside the point(just keep it to urself and move on) but u solved it

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Rob
Sudoku Master
Registered: 05/01/08
Posts: 302

    08/19/09 at 05:14 AMReply with quote#4

Quote:
Originally Posted by cew

I have seen several comments that empty rectangles fall into a category of difficult useless strategies.  Although only one candidate is removed, I find them an easy to spot pattern with a moderate frequency of occurrence.  I wonder if the reluctance to use them is because of a poor explanation of what to look for.  The name “empty rectangle” is confusing.  What is ‘in’ the box is important.  Candidates in one box confined to one row and one column and simple intersection strategy. Is the attached doc. a better explanation?

I wish the alternating inference network was as easy.  Seems to be a must for the very difficult puzzles. I am studying “fenyx’s” technique but not sure I can master it.    

 

I'm aware of the technique, but have only come across a few in live situations.  It's an interesting take on them to look for them at the same time as scanning for x-wings as I already do exactly that with finned x-wings.  Will certainly give it a try.

tman1937
Sudoku Master
Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 200

    08/19/09 at 01:53 PMReply with quote#5

 this is brainbashers aug19 superhard and i pulled the 7s out .....there are more (lots of) ways to solve it but this again became interesting....if u look hard enough C3 would be removed because of G3=b  and C9=A so that would make A3 the B   right????? yup  which would remove the 7 from A7......now look long enough and ull c the only place for a B making it the 7.....this is a very simple thing to find if ur stuck.....good name would be  duhhhhhh ok  the A/B solution.....lots an lots of em and as easy as the xwing (while u search for em)   help the dummies like me do the tough ones without a puter program.....

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Rob
Sudoku Master
Registered: 05/01/08
Posts: 302

    08/22/09 at 07:38 AMReply with quote#6

Hmmm.  Having been keeping an eye out for them while doing a few brainbashers, it seems that they tend to crop up at the same time as finned x-wings, normally with the same (or lesser) effect.  Of the last four finned x-wings I've seen on there, there was an empty rectangle on the same number at the same time, getting rid of some or all of the same candidates.  The original example is another where there's a finned x-wing also there.
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